[2002]

Thanks so I can use the same charging plug for both cars.

Yes you can use the same charge cable on both cars. The only difference is that in level 2 charging the Clarity will use at most 32 amps whereas the Ioniq can use up to 48 amps. However 48 amps charging requires having a 60 amp circuit, most home installations top out at a 50 amp circuit which will allow up to 40 amps of charging, or a 30 amp circuit which allows up to 24 amps of charging.

 

[CrzyQbn]

Thank you. And I assume a 50 amp set up would not hurt our Honda Clarity
plug in Hybrid.

 

[EV Nerd]

Thank you. And I assume a 50 amp set up would not hurt our Honda Clarity
plug in Hybrid.

Not a bit. An EVSE advertises how much current it can provide to the vehicle through the Pilot signal in the J1772 connector. The vehicle will take what it wants, but never above the advertised amount. The key compatibility to consider is that the EVSE isn't capable of taking more than 80% of what the circuit itself can provide.

 

[ClarityDave]

Not a bit. An EVSE advertises how much current it can provide to the vehicle through the Pilot signal in the J1772 connector. The vehicle will take what it wants, but never above the advertised amount. The key compatibility to consider is that the EVSE isn't capable of taking more than 80% of what the circuit itself can provide.

Or perhaps more correctly, the EVSE isn’t capable of passing more than…

 

[TheWu1976]

I use Level 1 @ home, however I've also used the free Volta Public Charging, which is Level 2, & have had no issues. It sounds to me like an issue with the car. having a higher amperage charger should not cause a problem, because a power source will only deliver what the car will take. As long as the voltage is right, amperage shouldn't make a difference. Now if the voltage is different COULD very well cause a problem. I'd take it back to the Honda Dealer, & have them try to charge it on THEIR level 2 charger. If it doesn't work, & since you've tried different sources, I suspect that it will not, they'll have to admit that it's either a problem with the car, or their charging station also isn't compatible with it, which wouldn't make any sense, since they are a Honda Dealer. Best of luck. If you can get this resolved, you'll see that these really are great cars.

 

[ClarityDave]

I use Level 1 @ home, however I've also used the free Volta Public Charging, which is Level 2, & have had no issues. It sounds to me like an issue with the car. having a higher amperage charger should not cause a problem, because a power source will only deliver what the car will take. As long as the voltage is right, amperage shouldn't make a difference. Now if the voltage is different COULD very well cause a problem. I'd take it back to the Honda Dealer, & have them try to charge it on THEIR level 2 charger. If it doesn't work, & since you've tried different sources, I suspect that it will not, they'll have to admit that it's either a problem with the car, or their charging station also isn't compatible with it, which wouldn't make any sense, since they are a Honda Dealer. Best of luck. If you can get this resolved, you'll see that these really are great cars.

The nomenclature of “charger” is actually incorrect. It’s actually an EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment). Instead of saying, “a power source will only deliver what the car will take”, it would be more correct to say that a car will only take what it needs. The EVSE merely communicates what it’s maximum ability to supply is. It is then left up to the car itself to determine how much current it will draw.

As far as voltage goes, I would suspect that the car would accept a wide range of voltages. In most of Japan, the common household voltage is 100V. In US it’s 120V. In Europe and other places it’s 230V. I can tell you for sure that the Clarity can charge at 100, 110, 120, 208, 220, 230, and 240 volts. My guess is that it will charge at any voltage between 90 and 240 volts.

 

[EV Nerd]

The nomenclature of “charger” is actually incorrect. It’s actually an EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment). Instead of saying, “a power source will only deliver what the car will take”, it would be more correct to say that a car will only take what it needs. The EVSE merely communicates what it’s maximum ability to supply is. It is then left up to the car itself to determine how much current it will draw.

As far as voltage goes, I would suspect that the car would accept a wide range of voltages. In most of Japan, the common household voltage is 100V. In US it’s 120V. In Europe and other places it’s 230V. I can tell you for sure that the Clarity can charge at 100, 110, 120, 208, 220, 230, and 240 volts. My guess is that it will charge at any voltage between 90 and 240 volts.

And all using the supplied OEM EVSE...if you're brave enough.

 

[2002]

The nomenclature of “charger” is actually incorrect. It’s actually an EVSE (Electric Vehicle Supply Equipment).

That's true. But I use the term charger all the time. As I mentioned back in post #69 of this long (but interesting) thread:

"nearly everyone uses the term "charger" or "charge cable" when referring to their EVSE, when in fact the actual charger is in the car (unless using DC charging which is not available for Clarity PHEV in the U.S.). However it's usually clear from the context of posts that when someone says charger they mean the EVSE."

I think it's an interesting technical fact which a lot of people aren't aware of, and always worth bringing up for that reason just so we can all be educated. But I don't begrudge anyone including myself for using that term when it's clear from the context that I am talking about the thing with the cable and nozzle that we plug into our cars, not the actual charger buried deep inside the car somewhere.

The key compatibility to consider is that the EVSE isn't capable of taking more than 80% of what the circuit itself can provide.

Technically it could, but it seems most EVSE manufactures set the maximum amp limit of the EVSE to the type of plug that it comes with. So for example a 40 amp EVSE comes with a 14-50 plug (40 amp is 80% of 50). Now for something like Tesla chargers that come with multiple adapters, I'm not sure how that works. If the owner pops on say the 14-30 adapter and plugs it into their dryer outlet, will the EVSE grab all 30 amps or just 24 amps? Does the EVSE have the ability to determine what size circuit it is plugged into? I know they can detect voltage, but I'm not sure how it would detect maximum amperage.

 

[ClarityDave]

That's true. But I use the term charger all the time. As I mentioned back in post #69 of this long (but interesting) thread:

"nearly everyone uses the term "charger" or "charge cable" when referring to their EVSE, when in fact the actual charger is in the car (unless using DC charging which is not available for Clarity PHEV in the U.S.). However it's usually clear from the context of posts that when someone says charger they mean the EVSE."

I think it's an interesting technical fact which a lot of people aren't aware of, and always worth bringing up for that reason just so we can all be educated. But I don't begrudge anyone including myself for using that term when it's clear from the context that I am talking about the thing with the cable and nozzle that we plug into our cars, not the actual charger buried deep inside the car somewhere.

I agree. And I’ve probably referred to it as “charger” a time or two myself but in this case the poster didn’t seem to have a correct understanding of what the “charger” actually does. But I could be wrong on that.

 

[jzchen]

DC at home anyone? (It also has capability for J-1772 hence I felt it's appropriate for this thread):

Our Product r16 - dcbel

Charge your electric vehicle with solar energy and transform its battery into a backup power source with dcbel r16.

www.dcbel.energy

 

[EV Nerd]

DC at home anyone? (It also has capability for J-1772 hence I felt it's appropriate for this thread):

Our Product r16 - dcbel

Charge your electric vehicle with solar energy and transform its battery into a backup power source with dcbel r16.

www.dcbel.energy

Interesting concept, but that's a lot of money for what appears to be still vaporware. The DC charge rate is only marginally better than the maximum available through the existing L2 standard. $5k to start, and it doesn't include the V2H features at that cost. Specs are generally a bit fuzzy, too.

 

[jzchen]

J1772 supports up to 80A. Is there any vehicle besides the Ford 150 Lightning that supports this 19.2 kW rate? Do all Lightnings support it?

19.2 kW would be faster than this Level "2.5" as they call it. Also my current Leviton (40A) is faster than their Level 2...

So far I see two companies that make 80A J1772s, Clipper Creek and WattZilla.

I like the r16 but cost is HIGH and don't want to break up our SolarEdge optimizer inverter system. Also V2H limited to two CHAdeMO vehicles, Nissan Leaf and Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV.

 

[obermd]

Or perhaps more correctly, the EVSE isn’t capable of passing more than…

Nope - the EVSE will attempt to draw current up to its capacity even if this is more than the circuit is rated for. Hopefully this will trigger the breaker on the circuit and not melt the wiring. The NEC (National Electric Code) specifies that for continuous draw that you're to not pull more than 80% of the circuit's rated current.

 

[obermd]

J1772 supports up to 80A. Is there any vehicle besides the Ford 150 Lightning that supports this 19.2 kW rate? Do all Lightnings support it?

19.2 kW would be faster than this Level "2.5" as they call it. Also my current Leviton (40A) is faster than their Level 2...

So far I see two companies that make 80A J1772s, Clipper Creek and WattZilla.

I like the r16 but cost is HIGH and don't want to break up our SolarEdge optimizer inverter system. Also V2H limited to two CHAdeMO vehicles, Nissan Leaf and Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV.

To draw 80 amps would require a 100 amp circuit. If I were going to pay an electrician to install a dedicated circuit I would install a 100 amp circuit, at least for the wiring. Changing a breaker for a lower amperage is easy but pulling the wire is hard.

 

[EV Nerd]

Nope - the EVSE will attempt to draw current up to its capacity even if this is more than the circuit is rated for. Hopefully this will trigger the breaker on the circuit and not melt the wiring. The NEC (National Electric Code) specifies that for continuous draw that you're to not pull more than 80% of the circuit's rated current.

I think the point he was making is that it's not the EVSE that draws current, it's the vehicle's on-board charger (OBC). The EVSE simply passes on the current. The amount it passes depends on what the vehicle draws. What the vehicle draws is limited by either the OBC capacity or the capacity that the EVSE advertises via the Pilot signal, whichever is less.

 

[jzchen]

The OP is asking for suggestions on Level 2 chargers. It's of my opinion to get as fast as one can reasonably afford lest they upgrade to a pure BEV in the future. The 80A (with appropriate 100 A wire and breaker) would seem to be the maximum J1772 would reach, but are the EVs adopting this maximum 19.2kW rate? Or do they use a lower rate and just leave high speed charging to DC, in which case purchasing the 80A would be a waste?

 

[jzchen]

WattZilla at least yesterday when I checked had/has a trade in/up program to get one of their 80A units, which although pricey the trade in would help me alleviate some of that cost....

 

[ClarityDave]

Nope - the EVSE will attempt to draw current up to its capacity even if this is more than the circuit is rated for. Hopefully this will trigger the breaker on the circuit and not melt the wiring. The NEC (National Electric Code) specifies that for continuous draw that you're to not pull more than 80% of the circuit's rated current.

The EVSE draws very little current, probably just a few watts. It is the vehicle which draws the majority of the current. The EVSE merely passes it along (i.e. current flows through the EVSE and generally it does not consume current).

 

[obermd]

The OP is asking for suggestions on Level 2 chargers. It's of my opinion to get as fast as one can reasonably afford lest they upgrade to a pure BEV in the future. The 80A (with appropriate 100 A wire and breaker) would seem to be the maximum J1772 would reach, but are the EVs adopting this maximum 19.2kW rate? Or do they use a lower rate and just leave high speed charging to DC, in which case purchasing the 80A would be a waste?

The F-150 Lightning will L2 charge at 19.2 KWh. I really think this is a case of how much power do you need to fully recharge the battery in 8 hours. Trucks will need more power than sedans or SUV/CUVs.

 

[obermd]

The EVSE draws very little current, probably just a few watts. It is the vehicle which draws the majority of the current. The EVSE merely passes it along (i.e. current flows through the EVSE and generally it does not consume current).

I think the point he was making is that it's not the EVSE that draws current, it's the vehicle's on-board charger (OBC). The EVSE simply passes on the current. The amount it passes depends on what the vehicle draws. What the vehicle draws is limited by either the OBC capacity or the capacity that the EVSE advertises via the Pilot signal, whichever is less.

You both missed my point. An EVSE rated to pass 80 amps at 240 volts cannot be wired into anything less than a 100 amp circuit per NEC standards. It doesn't matter if it's the vehicle or the EVSE that pulls the current, the fact that the EVSE is connected to the circuit and will allow this much current to be pulled through means it is the EVSE that must comply with the circuit restrictions. The J1772 standard is for EVSE/vehicle communications, not wall circuit/vehicle communications.