[jasonisalways]

I was wondering if anyone could point me the right direction to possibly change the exterior warning sound as the car moves forward in electric mode)

Any ideas / keywords / groups?
I would love to find the file and have several types of sounds - Locomotive - V8 - F1 racer - alien tractorbeam etc.

Thanks - love my "Batmobile"

 

[obermd]

Not without incurring the wrath of the NHTSA. Tesla tried this and was ordered to recall every single vehicle with the non-approved sound.

 

[4sallypat]

We have gotten used to the sound and it's not an issue for us anymore.
Changing the low speed warning sound may become a liability on you should you run over a pedestrian or cyclist...

 

[ClarityDave]

Not without incurring the wrath of the NHTSA. Tesla tried this and was ordered to recall every single vehicle with the non-approved sound.

If Tesla tried this and was shot down it’s because they are the manufacturer. The requirement to have the noisemakers on cars is laid upon the manufacturers by the federal government. Whether they have any jurisdiction over an individual making a change to the noisemaker or even removing it may be an entirely different story.

 

[obermd]

If Tesla tried this and was shot down it’s because they are the manufacturer. The requirement to have the noisemakers on cars is laid upon the manufacturers by the federal government. Whether they have any jurisdiction over an individual making a change to the noisemaker or even removing it may be an entirely different story.

It's a violation of Federal Law to modify any vehicle in such a way that it no longer meets the FMVSS requirements, so changing the sound is a violation. I don't think this would be enforced on individuals, but the EPA and NHTSA have been enforcing this on aftermarket tuners who delete emissions.

 

[ClarityDave]

It's a violation of Federal Law to modify any vehicle in such a way that it no longer meets the FMVSS requirements, so changing the sound is a violation. I don't think this would be enforced on individuals, but the EPA and NHTSA have been enforcing this on aftermarket tuners who delete emissions.

Do you know of any case law that supports the idea that a federal rule for a manufacturer has anything to do with what an individual does to their car within the confines of their state? Just curious. If the speaker on the car fails or degrades such that it no longer emits the noise, are you then violating the law by driving the car? Who would enforce that? Would you be pulled over by a police officer and ticketed for failure to make the noise when the car is being driven below a certain speed? Do police officers write tickets for violations of federal law or only state law?

 

[obermd]

Do you know of any case law that supports the idea that a federal rule for a manufacturer has anything to do with what an individual does to their car within the confines of their state? Just curious. If the speaker on the car fails or degrades such that it no longer emits the noise, are you then violating the law by driving the car? Who would enforce that? Would you be pulled over by a police officer and ticketed for failure to make the noise when the car is being driven below a certain speed? Do police officers write tickets for violations of federal law or only state law?

Part failures don't apply in this case. It's only when you change FMVSS mandated safety or emissions equipment that you're in violation. Local police don't normally enforce Federal Law, but if the change results in violations of the local laws then they'll ticket you for that. The EPA and NHTSA have spent the last few years cracking down on diesel emissions tuners that "delete" the emissions system from a diesel engine, putting many of them out of business.

 

[ClarityDave]

Part failures don't apply in this case. It's only when you change FMVSS mandated safety or emissions equipment that you're in violation. Local police don't normally enforce Federal Law, but if the change results in violations of the local laws then they'll ticket you for that. The EPA and NHTSA have spent the last few years cracking down on diesel emissions tuners that "delete" the emissions system from a diesel engine, putting many of them out of business.

So that’s my point. If there’s a state law that mandates the noisemaker then you may want to think twice about disabling it. If not, there’s nothing really preventing you from it. The federal law pertains to manufactures whom they have jurisdiction over by virtue of the fact that they are involved in interstate commerce. It cannot pertain to a person residing in a state in the same way that the federal government can not enact a nationwide speed limit. They lack jurisdiction. If they wanted to, they could force manufacturers to limit the top speed of their cars but they can’t keep you from driving the car as fast as you want.

 

[[email protected]]

Added parts from a canadian model clarity,

 

[Insighter]

So that’s my point. If there’s a state law that mandates the noisemaker then you may want to think twice about disabling it. If not, there’s nothing really preventing you from it. The federal law pertains to manufactures whom they have jurisdiction over by virtue of the fact that they are involved in interstate commerce. It cannot pertain to a person residing in a state in the same way that the federal government can not enact a nationwide speed limit. They lack jurisdiction. If they wanted to, they could force manufacturers to limit the top speed of their cars but they can’t keep you from driving the car as fast as you want.

There is a lot preventing you from disabling safety equipment. First, if you get in a related accident and it is disabled, you can bet the plaintiff's lawyer will focus in on that. It could subject you to civil and even criminal liability. Also, defeating or changing the sound might void your insurance coverage.

 

[Moonmack]

Added parts from a canadian model clarity,

View attachment 1007

I’m pretty sure the option to turn off the noise is for Canadian models before the 2020 model as I have not found this button on my car (2020 Canadian plug-in Clarity). If I remember the removal of this option may have been listed as a feature for the 2020 model.

 

[TheWu1976]

I’m pretty sure the option to turn off the noise is for Canadian models before the 2020 model as I have not found this button on my car (2020 Canadian plug-in Clarity). If I remember the removal of this option may have been listed as a feature for the 2020 model.

The manual for my 2018 says that this button to disable the external acoustic speaker is only on Canadian models. However, I've been wanting to look into retrofitting my U.S. model with this Canadian feature. Otherwise, I wonder if it's possible to simply disconnect the speaker. I haven't looked into it, yet.

It's a violation of Federal Law to modify any vehicle in such a way that it no longer meets the FMVSS requirements, so changing the sound is a violation. I don't think this would be enforced on individuals, but the EPA and NHTSA have been enforcing this on aftermarket tuners who delete emissions.

As far as I know, while Federal law does prohibit the tampering of emissions equipment, I'm not aware of any law pertaining to safety equipment. Those are usually state laws, if they even exist.

So that’s my point. If there’s a state law that mandates the noisemaker then you may want to think twice about disabling it. If not, there’s nothing really preventing you from it. The federal law pertains to manufactures whom they have jurisdiction over by virtue of the fact that they are involved in interstate commerce. It cannot pertain to a person residing in a state in the same way that the federal government can not enact a nationwide speed limit. They lack jurisdiction. If they wanted to, they could force manufacturers to limit the top speed of their cars but they can’t keep you from driving the car as fast as you want.

Actually, the Federal Government DOES have the jurisdiction to enact a federal speed limit. There used to be a federal speed limit of 55 miles per hour. This is why many older cars were also required to highlight 55 miles per hour on their speedometers. But this law was rescinded, I believe back in the 1990's.

 

[2002]

I wonder if it's possible to simply disconnect the speaker. I haven't looked into it, yet.

People who have disconnected the speaker say that you will then have a warning message on the dash which you can't make go away except by reconnecting the speaker.

 

[TheWu1976]

People who have disconnected the speaker say that you will then have a warning message on the dash which you can't make go away except by reconnecting the speaker.

That's unfortunate. Perhaps there is a tuning mod that can get rid of the warning message.

 

[obermd]

As far as I know, while Federal law does prohibit the tampering of emissions equipment, I'm not aware of any law pertaining to safety equipment. Those are usually state laws, if they even exist.

It's illegal to tamper with any mandatory equipment listed in the FMVSS. This covers both emissions and safety.

Actually, the Federal Government DOES have the jurisdiction to enact a federal speed limit. There used to be a federal speed limit of 55 miles per hour. This is why many older cars were also required to highlight 55 miles per hour on their speedometers. But this law was rescinded, I believe back in the 1990's.

Nope - what they did was pass a Federal Law that withheld highway maintenance funds from States that didn't enact 55 MPH. Rather than fight this by telling the Federal government that the Federal gas tax wouldn't be forwarded to the US Treasury and would instead be used to maintain roads and highways, the States caved to what was really no more than blackmail. The same thing happened to raise the drinking age from 18 to 21, despite the fact that 18 year old males are required to register for military service (draft).

 

[EV Nerd]

It's illegal to tamper with any mandatory equipment listed in the FMVSS. This covers both emissions and safety.



Nope - what they did was pass a Federal Law that withheld highway maintenance funds from States that didn't enact 55 MPH. Rather than fight this by telling the Federal government that the Federal gas tax wouldn't be forwarded to the US Treasury and would instead be used to maintain roads and highways, the States caved to what was really no more than blackmail. The same thing happened to raise the drinking age from 18 to 21, despite the fact that 18 year old males are required to register for military service (draft).

The 55 mi/hr "pressure" from the Fed even got pushback in popular culture. Case-in-point...Sammy Hagar:

 

[ClarityDave]

That's unfortunate. Perhaps there is a tuning mod that can get rid of the warning message.

It’s been proposed that you simply put an 8-ohm load across the audio output instead of connecting the speaker. In theory, the system is sensing the disconnecting of the speaker but a resistor should trick it into thinking the speaker is still hooked up.

 

[ClarityDave]

It's illegal to tamper with any mandatory equipment listed in the FMVSS. This covers both emissions and safety.



Nope - what they did was pass a Federal Law that withheld highway maintenance funds from States that didn't enact 55 MPH. Rather than fight this by telling the Federal government that the Federal gas tax wouldn't be forwarded to the US Treasury and would instead be used to maintain roads and highways, the States caved to what was really no more than blackmail. The same thing happened to raise the drinking age from 18 to 21, despite the fact that 18 year old males are required to register for military service (draft).

And this “blackmail“ is commonly used by the federal government to get states to do their bidding. We don’t have jurisdiction but we’ll withhold money from the states (who do have jurisdiction) if they don’t do what we want. In fact, the stranglehold is so strong that some people are actually led to believe that the feds actually do have jurisdiction. And that’s why some people believe that you can’t tamper with certain things.

If I believe that an oxygen sensor is not working properly on my car, can I replace it myself? Does the replacement have to be certified in some way? Could I replace the sensor with a non-OEM sensor? Could I replace it with a homemade one?

 

[obermd]

And this “blackmail“ is commonly used by the federal government to get states to do their bidding. We don’t have jurisdiction but we’ll withhold money from the states (who do have jurisdiction) if they don’t do what we want. In fact, the stranglehold is so strong that some people are actually led to believe that the feds actually do have jurisdiction. And that’s why some people believe that you can’t tamper with certain things.

If I believe that an oxygen sensor is not working properly on my car, can I replace it myself? Does the replacement have to be certified in some way? Could I replace the sensor with a non-OEM sensor? Could I replace it with a homemade one?

Illegal tampering is defined as removing or replacing a component so that the vehicle no longer meets FMVSS standards that were in place at the time of vehicle manufacture. This is a Federal violation, but unless you're making money doing this, such as the handful of diesel tuners who were actually deleting the diesel emissions equipment no one will go after you. As for your question, as long as the "homemade" sensor did the job then this would be legal - but very likely would void the emissions warranty if you still have one.

 

[2002]

It’s been proposed that you simply put an 8-ohm load across the audio output instead of connecting the speaker. In theory, the system is sensing the disconnecting of the speaker but a resistor should trick it into thinking the speaker is still hooked up.

I saw where someone was going to do that but they never came back to us with the results.

I have mixed feelings about this. I am somewhat skeptical that EV's and hybrids are any more dangerous to pedestrians than the typical modern gasoline car which can also be extremely quiet at low speeds. I wonder if there were actual studies done, or did someone just invent a problem that doesn't exist.

As for enforcement, that seems nearly impossible. How exactly is a police officer going to know if the sound has been disabled? Actually how are they even supposed to know which cars require it since it is only mandated on newer cars. So does a police officer say to themselves, "Hey that's a 2019 Accord hybrid pulling up to the light, it's supposed to have pedestrian alert." They then roll down their window and listen as the Accord drives slowly past them. Hearing only the tires squealing they turn on their flashers and pull the offender over.

As for if a pedestrian is hit by a car, even if the lawyer or insurance company suspects that the warning was disabled (which would be one in a million), how do they prove that? They would have to impound the car. Presumably by then the owner will have reconnected the speaker.

I'm not advocating one way or another, if this saves lives then I guess we can put up with a little bit of noise. But if there is no evidence for it then it's less of a concern.